Thursday, September 8, 2011

Ogres - My First Try

Be ready, this is gonna be a long one. Well I'd pointed out recently that I might be getting back into Fantasy with the release of the Ogres new book. And here I am, back into Fantasy. I have to say it's the first army book that I think I can get most of what I want out of it. I've always liked Dark Elves too but Ogres are just to cool. Nothing like running around with giant 3-wound monsters as your basic troops.

Anyway I've picked up a few items for what I think might be the beginning of my competitive list. I had a ton of models from the first release that will only require some minor tweaking but I'll be adding about $240 worth of stuff to my army to get what I might like out of it.

So I'm planning on attending a fantasy RTT which will probably be some of my first games of 8th edition ever which should be interesting. And I'm going to be doing it with a new book to the game as well which will make it more interesting. I've read through the rulebook a few times now and think I've got the basics down. I've stolen a couple of neat ideas from the dudes over on http://ogrestronghold.com/ who have been playing with the book as well since I'm so new to the game but here is what I'm thinking of running:

Lord

Slaughter Master of Butt Whoopin-385
Fencing Blades(35), Greedy Fist(40), and Glittering Scales(25), Level 4(35)

Core

8 Iron Guts-394
Standard(10), Lookout Gnoblar(5), Musician(10), Champion(10), Banner of Discipline(15)

6 Bulls-192
Ironfists

6 Bulls-192
Ironfists

Special

6 Man Eaters-392
6xBrace of Pistols(72), Sniper, Scout, Standard(10), Fire Standard(10)

1 Sabretusk-21

1 Sabertusk-21

4 Mournfang Calvary-280
Heavy Armor(20), Ironfist(20)

6 Lead Belchers-258

6 Lead Belchers-258

Lord:     485(19.4%)
Hero:     0(0%)
Core:     778(31.1%)
Special:  1230(49.3%)

So a ton of fantasy lists I see being built for Ogres have a boat load of characters and only like 20-30 actual ogres. This seemed a little crazy to me. Looking at the book it's the basic Ogres that look like killers to me. Hence the reason for my above list that sits at around 38 ogres not counting the calvary. Which I'm gonna explain a little.

First off the Slaughter Master. He's a combat beast that can magically support his battleline. His current build is based around armor being legal to be put on him as the Ironfist (shield) would indicate but could change. Then I'll probably just add a dispel scroll.

The 8-Man Irongut unit is where the Slaughter Master goes. Standard of Discipline bumps his leadership to 9 though I'm not sure if this will extend to the Inspiring Pressence rule or not. Either way this is a hammer unit that will normally run w/3 Ranks and produce 16 St6 + Slaughter Master attacks, impact hits, and stomp attacks which is pretty nasty.

The two Bull units are fast support units that can hold their own against almost any units that aren't hordes and even some of those. Plus it's a bit more core.

The Maneaters are a solid unit that will deploy where needed after both sides have deployed thanks to scout. The flaming banner makes them a solid unit for picking off regenerating units and the sniper ability will allow them to pick out bsb's and mages. Basically deploy the unit to pick off a bad man on turn one and then use them as a hammer to support your line. In combat you're looking at 21 St5 attacks and stomp attacks after the first round of combat.

The two individual sabretusks are to help with deployment, allowing me to really start deploying after my opponent has put down a unit or two. They also will move up away from my lines (to prevent panic tests) and I can use them to slip up and possibly taking out warmachines if they are ignored or taking some shooting off my ogre units.

The Mournfang Calvary are straight up beasts. They roll hard and heavy and are geared to grind down massive units of non-elite infantry but aren't half bad against elite infantry either. They have a 2+/6++ in CC and a 4 man unit sits at 12 St4, 16 St 5, and 4 Stomp attacks per turn in CC. Add in a D3 impact hit per model and you're looking at a meatgrinder of a unit.

And lastly Leadbelchers. They've gotten super hot in this new book. The cannon is D6 shots per turn, st 4, armor piercing, can move-and-fire, and only takes penalties for long range. Oh and the range has changed to 24". Basically 13pts more than a standard bull to give him a gun which is pretty crazy. Add in that they can shoot every turn now and you're looking at a unit that can over the course of the game have a major impact. Probably one of the better "ranged" units out there. And they aren't half bad in combat either.

So that's the reasoning behind the list. I don't know much about 8th yet so I'm sure there will be a few changes but I'm looking forward to my first few games of Fantasy over the next few weeks. Thoughts, even if you don't know much about Fantasy are welcome since I don't know much either :)

Comments (12)

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Lunchmoney's avatar

Lunchmoney · 707 weeks ago

My only concern is your lack of resilience on the bulls. I would combine them and grab FC for em by dropping one.
1 reply · active 707 weeks ago
Resilience isn't really what they are there for honestly. Though once I start playing more I might see the advantage of combining and adding a full command.
I have very little knowledge of fantasy and don't play it, but there was a guy playing with the new 'dex the other day. He used some nasty piece of wargear that made all mages within D6x5" take a perils (or whatever it's called in Fantasy) test. I think he said it cost 50 points, but one made died and the other lost a wound.

Interesting piece of kit. Not sure if it's worth the 50... but it certainly was in the scenario. Maybe too situational?
1 reply · active 707 weeks ago
Yeah, the Hellheart is pretty sweet but I think it's better if you're running more mages. Which at the cost of characters doesn't seem reasonable to me. Though most lists I see in fantasy seem to have shifted back to around 40% characters which I've never been entertained by :)

In my opinion I should be able to snipe any mage that isn't a level 3-4 in a single shooting phase with the Maneaters and I'd rather have a kill mage that's hard as hell to hit. You need a WS5 just to him on a 5+ otherwise it's a 6+ which combined with T5 and W5 that can regenerate when I cast spells means I should be alright.
spyguyyoda's avatar

spyguyyoda · 707 weeks ago

I like how you are going character light, but I really think you need to look at getting a Bruiser BSB. The ld 9 for your general (yes it works for Inspiring Presence) is good, but re-rolls are golden. If you give a BSB the standard of discipline, you could also shrink the size of your Ironguts and take a slightly larger unit of bulls to plop the two characters in. The bulls are more resilient than then IG because they have the same Armor Save and can parry...plus they are 11 points cheaper so you can take more of them.
1 reply · active 707 weeks ago
spyguyyoda's avatar

spyguyyoda · 707 weeks ago

Sorry...having problems posting this...here's the rest of the comment ;)

In fact, in order to take the BSB in the first place you may want to consider swapping them out for more bulls entirely...just a thought.

Everything else is pretty standard/awesome.
All of the good lists take like 20-30% characters. You're good with just the slaughtermaster; though if you loose him it's going to really suck. Leadership tests will not go your way.

Not sure that Sniper is going to be the best for the Maneaters; I'd load up on Poison, as it adds to ranged and melee. Remember how good old rending was?
I see many things that i find wrong with this list.

First, yes, our core seems nice with T4, 3 wounds and all the goodies, but we got low armor, and WS3, which means that pretty much everyone will hit us on 3s...

That's the reason why people usually spend much more pts on character, to use the small frontage to our advantage and force people to try to wound 2 very hard to wound character.

Running BSB-less in 8th is pretty rare, only race that really dont need it do it (like Tomb Kings). You may want to risk it, but keep in mind that as soon as your Tyrant is dead, your whole army rely on a single Ld7/8 roll to stay on the table...Its especially important when you consider that your SM will be prone to cannonball in the head as soon as 4 of your Ironguts are dead... (and with the lack of wardsave, it might come faster than you though).

also, your 12 Leadbelchers sound nice on paper, but consider the price you're spending for roughly 7-8 wounds a turn... its not much.

Maneater with sniper is nice, they could prove worth it. A way to enhance them (imho) would be to give them poison instead of scout. That way, they will wound as soon as they hit (since, well, you'll be hitting on 6s anyway). It also give them the advantage of being able to take on big beast like Sphynx without too much trouble.

Lastly, for the love of god, get Ironcurse icon... its 5 pts, and it can save your ass.
1 reply · active 707 weeks ago
Great points on most of this stuff. Two things I'll disagree with you on. One is the Leadbelchers. I think they add a lot to an army that swings as slowly and has as poor of an armor save as Ogres do. 7-8 wounds a turn isn't much until those 7-8 kills are against Great Weapon toting horde units. Or just units that are a threat to me in general. It's basically a solid CC unit that can soften up my opponents early in the game and can lend a helping hand in CC. The other is the Scout vs. Poison. If I drop scout for poison yes, I'll be hitting on 6's (Sniper, Long Range, Multiple Shots) however if I take scout I can move into half range and hit on 5's. This is if Assasinating is big on my mind. If it's not then I can deploy in an adventageous position and start rolling the enemy flank and force them to deal with me. I just think scout gives me more options as the sniper special rule is just meant to be situational. I'll probably be in combat almost every turn of every game, I mean 24 St5 attacks and 3 St5 Stomps is pretty solid in CC.
I'd like to add that I'm also an idiot and have 100 more pts to spend.....Which means a Bruiser BSB is probably in the works. I can probably get the points back by switching the big unit into bulls and making one of the 6-mans into Iron Guts.....I'll have to play with it. Great feedback so far guys. I appreciate it.
1 reply · active 707 weeks ago
spyguyyoda's avatar

spyguyyoda · 707 weeks ago

Yay! I'm helping! =)

As far as the Maneaters, Vanguard with Sniper has also been proposed. The advantage with that is that they can charge first turn if needed, as opposed to Scout. I like Scout though, because it lets you place them right in range to put a cap in Teclis (or whomever).
I have to agree that a BSB seems to be the one thing that you are missing. LD 9 is great, but being able to reroll any LD test is gold. Also, a bruiser is fairly potent in combat as well.
I think you're fine with the 2 units leadbelchers. I run a single unit of 8 and I think it's one of the best units in the book.
Same with Maneaters, I love them. I use Scout and Stubborn and then use them as more of a flanking unit, but I can see the sniping strategy working as well. The ability to deploy last and just about anywhere you want is just great and has forced my opponent to adjust and react from T1.
Those are just my first thoughts. Looking forward to seeing how you get on with them!

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